Big Think

HerbieP on October 21, 2008, 3:24 AM

Well it’s good to get things off your chest but religion has always been political. In fact it is very rare to have states that are entirely secular (whatever their constitutions might say). Also you seem to be assuming that religions have something to do with solving problems of homelessness, healthcare and famine. I think that a careful reading of the Abrahamic religious texts (for example) will demonstrate that they are quite fond of causing war, xenophobia, famine and turning people out of their homes.

Musycks on October 21, 2008, 3:50 AM

Nice rant rezzerektion.. I agree there’s no god in your politics… but I think we need to keep god out of politics for reasons other than yours I fear.. imaginary entities have no place in real politik…
it’s hard enough dealing with reality without the supernatural overlay… but I hope you feel better for getting that off your chest.
I think the Yanks are electioned out Herbie.. their bloody campaign lasts 2 years at least!

HerbieP on October 21, 2008, 4:18 AM

Interesting that a professed atheist would have no chance of being elected in a supposedly secular state. rezzerektion is correct that candidiates are forced to wear their religions in plain sight.

The abortion position is a religious one rather than a political one and the one real worry to Obama supporters.

sciencesaves on October 21, 2008, 9:07 AM

How true. We’re still electing folks who seem to think “god” has “chosen” them. Palin is an example of this, she doesn’t seem to be lying about faith like the other three. Personally, she seems like a good person, but the Governorship is already stretching the limits of her abilities, and as old as McCain is, the stress of a presidency could finish him off before a term expires.
Once again, we have to vote for the lesser of two evils, and Obama seems very presidential, but he remains a question mark on a lot of issues.

If Obama is elected, he may put the Clintons back in power positions, remember Hillary’s healthcare “plan”?

We can’t blame the existence of religion as the problem, immorality will happen. The real problem is irrational belief. We must insist on solid evidence, otherwise, we live in the dark ages of man, making up “gods”.

Matt Pidlysny on October 21, 2008, 1:33 PM

I find it ironic, while you guess here about the First Ruler’s true intentions, you don’t even know the equation that fed us into this age. You don’t know how many anomalies there are in the design, or the like of any sort. For all you know, and it makes sense to me, if there was a design, it would explain why things are the way they are today, and perhaps Sarah Palin was always destined to be who she is today.

But to share religion in politics is just putting yourself in a world of hurt. Leave it behind, disconnect from the concept of God, because you just harm your spirit when you go against him.

dennis ilic on October 21, 2008, 4:39 PM

rezzerection, it is a pleasant surprise to ‘see’ you again. Welcome back to the monkey house.

HerbieP on October 22, 2008, 2:05 AM

Resonator, Garett Lisi’s work can be looked at in a way that obviates the need for ‘design’ (I don’t know if Lisi would see it that way – nice guy but not a great public speaker). If the geometry is correct there is no need for ‘creators’.

http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/garrett_lisi_on_his_theory_of_everything.html

The results of the standard model could not have been presented so elegantly when I was a lad (not enough computing power), we could only use the equations.

This also demonstrates how the word ‘dimension’ is used in mathematics (sorry rezzerection this is a little off thread – but we all might be a bit better off if US candidates understood and supported science with the same vigour that they do religion.

sciencesaves on October 22, 2008, 9:07 AM

Falling back on the hypothesis of a “first rulers design” does not provide any answers as to why that would be necessary. If you assume that to be the case, from lack of evidence, or merely wishful thinking, it will only cause more frustration.

Environment affects “destiny”, which is merely destination. An individuals actions and decisions in that environment will affect outcomes. Choices should be made from a realistic point-of-view, and religion is not realistic as a moral compass any longer, and thankfully so.

It’s true that we still have a lot to learn about the universe and humans, but any searcher looking for truth has to let go of the delusions and follow the golden rule, avoiding the seven “deadly sins”. If one needs to imagine irrational entities in order to behave like a “rational” person, I would not trust them to operate as an reasonable person, religion creates too much prejudice, and there’s enough of that around already.

Res., You seem like a thoughtful and intelligent chap, why do you insist upon the existence of a creator, and why would you think that this creator has any effect on what happens in the world? You’re at the last step to enlightenment it seems, but perhaps fear of the unknown is compelling the beliefs?

Tolerance of religion has greatly slowed the process of discovery for a very long time. Here in the US, it has handicapped a lot of folks with narrow-minded vision, and Palin is a good example.

Musycks on October 22, 2008, 7:30 PM

Guys… I think Resonators recent addition of a picture icon is instructive here… Dr Timothy Leary if I’m not mistaken.
The voices in Resonators head may have to do with some bad LSD!
I can hear the sitars even now….

Matt Pidlysny on October 22, 2008, 8:24 PM

I’m sure it’s always a possibility, but if I may I’ve never done the drug. I’ve told you before I have no fear of losing my faith in these sayings.

I insist, SS, because I have never experienced this, and to reject this would lead ultimately to me being commited. I have no intentions of letting myself be controlled by negativity, do you? Is that what you try to tell me, to forget what I learned and let the voices rule my thoughts?

It seems there is more proof on my side of the fence. Whereas I have something, you’ve got nothing. You believe in nothing, in this manner. Why don’t you commit yourself to your own inner self and fight for the just? I’ve heard ZERO commentary on possibility (Save for Herbie, sorry for getting mad by the way), just useless justification based on “Oh, well nothing has happened that I have seen so I’m Atheist,”

For the record, Agnostic means not to know. You are Agnostic until you’ve seen proof, then deny it. THEN you become Atheist. Read your Greek lesson book, please.

Try seeing. I KNOW there are some of you who read this and I hear your thoughts when you mention my name. I speak to you, in fact, those of you who are not so unwilling to believe because you don’t hinder the process.

You have never experienced anything like it before ;)

So let’s go off the unknown, rather than useless arguing. The Secret Book of John indicates that when the First Ruler shone light into the 4th dimension, it shone light into darkness and created the “Murky gloom”. So perhaps nothing existed in that dimension but empty space? It would make sense, considering I think I’ve figured out the “Incomprehensible”, so to speak.

The Incomprehensible dimension, or simply put the 5th dimension is true infinity. It is a place where infinite things can exist and be created, and my guess is that everything happens simultaneously on this realm (Time not existing) but that’s something I can’t figure out completely. The book mentions that there are a number of “Aeons”, or eternal realms for the sake of understanding. These must be places that exist separately, like there is a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th dimension within each, and they are all separate from the 5th dimension by a “veil” (The only description of it in the book is that it’s a veil).

So it’s like a chain reaction. Everything is in darkness in these realms before anything truly exists in them. They lay dormant, so to speak. When light is shone into the darkness, it gives darkness a place to co-exist with Light. Therefore, it is imperfect, as darkness doesn’t really exist. This is probably also why the holy ones refer to it as darkness, or shadow, and nothing else.

So if part of you is made of light (I think the wave-particle duality is of some use here to explain, if only I could in better terms) then what the hell is casting it away to create darkness doing to you mentally?

Now let’s say that your environment is what guides you to make decisions. One event leads to another, manipulating you before your very eyes. You see, while free thought is what makes us unique, to say your environment makes your decisions for you means you have none at all. And it seems you surely do, so I consider this hypocrisy. How to avoid fate but meet your destiny? Hint: It’s Gnosticism.

Musycks on October 22, 2008, 8:32 PM

strangely I’m fully acquainted with the definition of agnostic. It’s a little light on for what I feel.
You might look up a defintion of atheist… it is not ‘belief in nothing’ as you erroneously suggest.. try non-belief in deities, there is quite a difference, unless you accept the lazy thinking of the theists.

Matt Pidlysny on October 22, 2008, 8:38 PM

Yeah, well the definition was probably written out of fair judgment, so that being said I guess you can define it as you will. But I’m just saying that you believe in not knowing, therefore Agnostic.

Musycks on October 23, 2008, 1:47 AM

Resonator… a definition is written out of agreed parameters of understanding, so when someone uses a word, another person has a good chance of reading the appropriate meaning into it… so I can’t define it as I want. It is what it is.
An agnostic says ‘we can’t be sure, so we can’t know, so I don’t know either way, so I’m agnostic’.
An atheist does not see the world as being other than it is, a natural environment. No gods, fairies, sprites, nympths, angels, devils, ghosts, etc… no supernatural overlay to what we experience. What some people say they hear or see in their own heads is mere heresay…. and mostly delusional.
One of the most potent laws of the law of probability… which says in tens of thousands of years of human history there has been no credible evidence for this ‘other’ world you speak of.. so it’s a statistical certainty it does not exist other than in some peoples infantile imagination.

I hope this clears up what I mean by atheist.

sciencesaves on October 23, 2008, 9:14 AM

We’re all born agnostics, or perhaps atheists, but the human condition creates a need for reassurance, even if that source is unverifiable.

Is there a POSSIBILITY that god exists? Sure, but that is quickly becoming an extremely remote possiblity, the more we understand about our universe. There will always be those who assign conclusions to random neuron firings in their heads, without a shred of evidence.

Belief in god is not acceptable when a reasonable thinking human understands the history of the paradox, and realizes that there has NEVER been proof of ANY religious claims EVER.

The power of suggestion has carried the religious concepts of primitive man into the modern age.

It’s time for something rational.

Bible quotes are irrational.

I hope you’re not suffering too much.

Matt Pidlysny on October 23, 2008, 1:16 PM

Bible quotes are irrational.

I would go so far as to say you’re horribly mistaken. Firstly, because the stories in the bible are relative to very real events, and knowing who wrote what and at what time are more important for the sake of pursuing possibility then simply not looking for proof, such as you among many other people in this world. I was about to say Roakes but he seems to stand neutral so I caught myself.

Secondly, this is not biblical quotes. These are things that should have been in the bible, sure, but they were rejected. People didn’t understand, and in the competition Gnosticism was wiped out by the word “Heresy”. People didn’t NEED to understand Gnosticism, they just needed God and his son Jesus, one of which was already ingrained in their minds (I think that’s the right word, “ingrained”). It was just an easy transfer of faith, because they had proof of “Gods” son being born on earth.

By the way, SS, I’d like to hear something different or I might call the spam card to the moderators of this fine vessel on you ;)

sciencesaves on October 23, 2008, 4:50 PM

I understand your sentiments, and I apologize for my blanket dismissal of the bible, but for all the truth it contains, there is an equal amount of unbelieveable embellishment and blatant untruth.

We do not need to eliminate all the good moral direction that is conveyed by religion, only the unproven and fantastic claims that have never been verified.

Events portrayed in the bible are subject to the limited understanding of those who lived at the time. When knowledge was lacking, they seem to have used imagination and wishful thinking to reach conclusions that we now know to be highly suspect, and actually detremental to critical thinking.

There is no proof of “gods” son being born on earth. Jesus was a man, same as you and I. To perpetuate his martyrdom based upon the manipulations of others is ridiculous.

Now, what is it that you would like to hear? That I respect your viewpoint?
I can appreciate your intelligence and ability to communicate, but I can’t give any credence to claims of supernatural knowledge, because there has never been any proof of such by anyone, ever.

Sorry to take the hardline with you, but I sense that you’re very close to understanding reality, ie: enlightenment, and I always try to encourage folks to think through what they claim to believe, and provide more than hearsay as testament.

I’ll throw out first. I’ve been a contributor on this website for about 8 months now, and through all the discussions, I have never read anything that would lead me to believe that the god concepts are plausible.

I’m still waiting for proof. Until then, I will dismiss all unverifiable “knowledge” as overactive imagination.

Being “wrong” doesn’t bother me, I just need something more than the average non-thinker accepts as fact.

Bring it on.

Mike in Ohio

Matt Pidlysny on October 23, 2008, 6:32 PM

Now, what is it that you would like to hear?

Well, personally I’d like you to read the books that I’ve mentioned to you countless times before, but there needs to be a neutrality to reading it. I can see from what you’ve posted that you haven’t read the Secret Book of John, or the Three Forms of First Thought, or the Revelation of Adam, or any of these books to understand WHY things are the way they are.

I’ve explained my robust theory on the 4th dimension, but like I said it IS robust, at best. However, thinking of it now brings a new question I’d like to answer: What is controlling time?

Time is a dimension, normally just free flowing in darkness, like I explained. But since the First Ruler was born out of imperfection he was sent to the 4th dimension to exist freely, without knowledge of the heavenly spirits in the 5th. By being there, and shining the light of his creation upon the entire dimension and the others that exist below the veil, he lit up the darkness to make a neutral balance of light and dark.

You gotta see this part as engineered. The mother-creator of all started this model of existence, set everything up right, and did her work under the noses of the father and the other Aeons (The 5th dimension beings to us would be like places to exist rather than people, again), though I’m sure he knows by now, and (To mention a few) did a couple of things in this manner:

1) She created the self-incarnated spirit, who became known as Jesus while during his time on Earth and she prepared him for it, like the book says,

2) She is forethought, one of “5 trees in paradise”. It becomes naturally a possibility that she can, in fact, manipulate foreknowledge in this manner, and it’s my belief that I feel she came into Sophia, who in turn created Yalbadaoth (First Ruler, Jewish god). He was the first beyond the veil.

One thing I’d like to mention is that the acts in the Secret Book of John or the Revelation of Adam describe the actions quite accurately in terms of right and wrong, but you gotta know it’s like watching a kid play with toys. Big, incomprehensible toys, so to speak :P

Now, to the point of it all. Since the 4th dimension is the dimension for time, it came under his control partially. Everything he created in the lower dimensions he could control, and he could create his angels in the 4th dimension. When he made Adam, he created 365 angels to flow with time, because he would be able to continue an illusion of time by implementing new things, new patterns into different angels. And I’ve mentioned before, the angels I speak of are Temporal Objects, existing in 4th. They see them as angels, people if you like.

Life then becomes an equation. You begin to react to your environment, which was built in layers of events by people throughout time. It’s a perfect system, but it is still darkness causing illusion. The light made the illusion real, but only to people who couldn’t see past it. Gnosticism, as a behavioural pattern, strictly commands free thought ALWAYS. That’s why I believe we are called the Unshakable Race, the ones from Seth, and quite coincidentally Jesus’s bloodline. You know where to go for information on that.

Look beyond the illusion, if you want to prove yourself right. You can make Atheism real and right, so to speak (It’s just in terms of time being an all powerful illusion), in your mind. When we go, we’re leaving our clothes behind, but once you become unshakable, you go beyond.

Musycks on October 23, 2008, 7:53 PM

Resonator, you’ve got some catching up to do… this site has dissected the Gnostic writings in the past… don’t assume you’re the only one who knows that history.. I mention Valentian before and you were silent?
To threaten Mike as a spammer is rich indeed.. you present the illogical ramblings of the deluded as against his calm reason and he’s the problem? I don’t think so.. as your bullshit radar appears to be non-existant, can I suggest you print out these 3 handy phrases I’ve come across and stick them to your computer or fridge..

1. Anything that can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence.

2. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

3. Absence of evidence is evidence of absense.

Good luck on your journey.

Matt Pidlysny on October 23, 2008, 8:22 PM

Yet you fail to see just how much you’ve deluded yourself. Take a look around, everything on Earth is living proof of the bible’s validity! Everything that the bible says, we CAN see evidence of it. You look for the evidence of how it came to be, so therefore it’s a matter of time travel, and for that you kinda need a magnifying glass of sorts. You need the All Seeing Eye, and I would say where it is found is where you shall see the truth.

But say the All Seeing Eye is hiding, or being hidden. How does one create a tool out of themselves, through meditation or a tool they can’t possibly know how to calibrate without doing it themselves first? Every tool you own is based on a human interaction. From a telescope (Eye see rock on ground), to a microphone (Ears listen to bird in tree), to a hammer (Fist smash face good).

A human had to do it first before the idea was even conceived. You can’t say, in other words, you’ve tried hard enough to find the truth. There is no possible way, if it’s not present here to argue.

Musycks on October 23, 2008, 9:09 PM

I’m done with the gibberish Resonator… I have no capacity for trying to interpret your nonsensical ramblings any longer… good luck to you.
I’ll read Herbies correspodence with you with interest, but I’m out.

Matt Pidlysny on October 24, 2008, 4:43 AM

Hey, I’m just speaking from a literal stance. To accomplish what you want to do 100% efficiently you need a tool that is All Seeing, such as the All Seeing Eye. But if such a thing is not available, can it be made available by creating a tool out of your physical body?

There’s just not enough exploration into the possibility is all. I’d do it in a heartbeat, and I could guarantee return investments were it to be funded as such. I say it to reinforce how sure I am at finding the way to see God. I mean, who else would you rather have at the helm of such a project, Oliver Sacks? :P

sciencesaves on October 24, 2008, 8:43 AM

resonator, You seem to have a problem separating truth from fiction. Based on your elaborate, complex, and unverifiable claims, I cannot take you seriously.

Herbie will clear up the science for you, and musycks will help you to understand the beauty of reality, as opposed to fantasy, but as long as you choose to embrace that which does not exist, you will never be able to shed the religious cloak of darkness and subliminal control.

What will you be thinking is real, years from now, after you become disappointed with your manufactured illusions due to lack of evidence?

My condolences. I hope you can get beyond the level of thinking that you’re stuck with for now…

Matt Pidlysny on October 24, 2008, 2:08 PM

Well, SS, there’s no other way for me to prove the existence of God, other than the fact that you are awakening even if you don’t realize it, and the SECOND you drop your inhibition to believe, you will be astounded by what you find. When you pursue the life that God will give you (The Jewish god, Fist Ruler) today, he will lead you to the truth. How many times must I say that? It’s your fear to believe that stops your body from becoming the ultimate tool right NOW!

And I say this with confidence, because I’ve heard WAY to many coincidental stories for this not to be true:

December 21st, 2008. If there are no Aliens present on this day, “When the Equinox reaches it’s peak”, you will never have to believe in God again. It is all a lie, and you can rest knowing reality still has a grip on your mind. Of course, the closed mind accepts no guarantees and truthfully lives for nothing, but hey what do I know, I was never like that once, I was born this way!

You are not a free thinker, even if you think you are. Otherwise your free mind would pursue knowledge and truth, and I see a high lack of evidence to support the fact that you are. You just give in to design after design until your mind is clouded with not knowing, with assuming, with every illusion reality has in store for you.

I just can’t understand how people KNOW how to make the tool to see God, but never will because they don’t want to. People like you, SS, are AFRAID of finding his truth. You LIKE the fact that you are alone, and that somehow inside you just fear the fact that when his truth is shone, your world is going to fall apart, and you will be left with nothing.

Do not let time leave you empty handed. Do not pay attention to mindless ramblings and arguments between peons of the faith. Seek truth and knowledge in EVERYTHING you do. Exercise your right to be a free thinker, and do not succumb to the fate which was designed for you. We DO have a higher purpose, we ARE real, and the greatest part of all, when you become like me you will become invincible, PURELY because your knowledgeable mind tells the body to be as such. You fill yourself with light, in this manner, because foreknowledge is divine and making knowledge forthought makes it light for you to use in this manner. What more must I say to help you overcome yourself?

To be a bit more negative, this whole idea that God cannot be proven is pure laziness on all of your parts, those with accessibility to any sort of lab equipment needed to analyze the body. I promise you that I can make the machine to find God, but I cannot believe it was not thought of sooner. It’s such a simple concept, and you said your science was all knowing, yet it cannot even prove a simple concept with known techniques of meditation.

Thus, I will deliver the Atheists decree:

1) I will never say never again because I did not even try out of lack of want for the truth,
2) I will come to know how foolish Atheism really is because it only serves to offer illusion once reality begins to break into pieces before the end of 2008,
3) I will blend science and ancient practices to find the truth about God, in any small way I can.

Say these things with sincerity and you’ll find God in science. You just have to look in the right place, and I’m willing to be used to show you all the way to truth.

LET ME BE YOUR GUINEA PIG, FOR PETE’S SAKE!!!

sciencesaves on October 24, 2008, 5:29 PM

Holy shit! That one qualifies as spam, I hate to say. Pointing out the obvious problems with most of what you state doesn’t seem to give you pause whatsoever, so I’ll spare myself the effort.

You can’t convince me with empty reasoning, and I’m starting to think that you’ve completely lost your grip on reality, if you ever had one.

You assume way too much. It seems that most believers tend to think that enlightened folks don’t “get it”.

We “get it” all too well, “believe me”.

This approach may work on those vulnerable to suggestion, but I’ve been around too long and seen too much to play along with the childish imaginings.

I hope your delusions don’t cause others pain, and that you eventually see the light, but you have no business promoting or attempting to explain anything religious or scientific here.

Convoluted logic is a fools game.

Matt Pidlysny on October 24, 2008, 6:17 PM

I’m just saying, John, I’ve got more proof that he exists than you do. I myself possess physical evidence he exists, and I also possess a book that says he exists.

Tell me: When you looked into the 4th dimension, what did you see? Oh wait, you DIDN’T.

Something exists, John. It’s presence is felt across the board. Aliens will be here by December, you will feel disoriented by then, and you most likely are one of God’s army because I observe your lack of belief. You’ve given up hope, and I just wish I could change that.

I apologize for every rude, ignorant, mean thing I said here before. Won’t happen again, but I just wish you hadn’t lost faith in the possibility. I mean, you say that nothing has come before you to prove God.

Well, here I am, the one that understands the plight of the Antichrist, who is divine and yet satanic at the same time, the ONLY one that I can see who has been gifted with any knowledge of that matter, coming before you. And STILL you have no conviction to believe, in your heart. Is it so wrong, to put faith in something, such a coincidence?

Tell you what, since this is the beginnings of this: I’ll stop smoking cigarettes when you believe in my words about, SS. You now have the opportunity to do a nice thing for someone, and control the length of my habit.

Is the risk worth the gain?

sciencesaves on October 24, 2008, 9:48 PM

resonator, I’m not sure who you’re addressing with your last entry.

Please tell me you have something of substance to contribute, other than the deluded self-promotion, and “poor unbelievers” routine.

Who the hell is John?

Matt Pidlysny on October 25, 2008, 2:10 AM

You know what? John is the distortion of me trying so hard to find proof to ease your transition into spirituality. There is such thing as trying too hard, I guess.

When we speak next, I will have a clearer mind. My anxiety made me too hyperactive for my own good, and I got swallowed up by a mistake that came out as “John”. We’ll leave it at that for now.

sciencesaves on October 25, 2008, 8:20 AM

Once a person endures all the religious nonsense, and finally understands that the whole business is ridiculous, it is highly unlikely that they will ever entertain the extremely remote possibility that there is somehow a mysterious force getting inside their head.

I too hope that you can overcome your current outlook, and eventually see that there is no need to allow religious concepts to weaken your thinking skills.

The last step is where a lot of people give up on reality and fall back into irrational belief. They go up and down the stairs of religion, hoping to find something that they had inside them all along, but couldn’t grasp through the god-concept fog.

I will never allow religion to affect my thinking, I don’t want to regress back into man-made mental “imprisonment”.

pokój! on October 26, 2008, 4:22 AM

just one comment through all this…
(I’m not picking on you ss, but honestly I don’t feel comfortable commenting on most of whats been said here… [I must be one of those ‘peons of the faith’ that Resonator refers to…] but I do find it all alarmingly interesting yet out of place especially in this topic, but hey where the discussion starts is irrelevant)

"You assume way too much. It seems that most believers tend to think that enlightened folks don’t “get it”."

All this trouble we’re having understanding each other would be a bit eased if we stopped considering ourselves more enlightened than others for various reasons and realised that we are all humans… I think we are at least… this especially goes to all who claim to be seeking to bring spirituality back into line with the rest of our daily lives…

Shi Hyung Park on October 26, 2008, 3:44 PM

Well look at Europe in the 1400s where the Crusade was happening. Politics were mixed with God. What happened to them? Their lost was hindering to the Muslims. Look at World War 2 the Pope was able to STOP the Holacost but why didn’t he stop it? It was because he wanted the holy land in Iseral.
Really is human this pathetic?

Matt Pidlysny on October 26, 2008, 6:11 PM

I too hope that you can overcome your current outlook, and eventually see that there is no need to allow religious concepts to weaken your thinking skills.

Ok, now this I have to disagree with. While I should be getting past my current outlook on my ability, it does NOT mean it wasn’t healthy for me to do. You fail to realize, SS, that in this manner we EXERCISE our minds. It’s important for one to be guided through their mental delusions, so as to memorize and learn (By themselves) what is truth and what is false, as I have, and more importantly, the WHY it was false.

You can save so many minds in this manner. I’m honestly thinking of committing myself to make up for what current psychoanalysts lack in terms of knowledge in this manner. While they are right in building holes into peoples delusion, there is a certain falseness to Hollywood’s perspective, and I’m really interested in working with individuals to see just how much the doctors have avoided seeing that this paranoia/schizophrenia/whatever is truly a challenge from God. The fact that we can overcome thoughts like this with our mental strength is extraordinary, and I think it’s worth pursuing. It gave me strength, and I would rather see them indoctrinated with positive thought rather than negative. I’m starting to think that’s why some of them are still in the psych wards in the first place, if the doctors are all like SS and the rest of you who just dismiss it as delusion, without really caring as to why.

The crazy ones just might be the chosen ones, as there is a slightly odd coincidence they have been possessed by fear. Without light, there is no shadow, as they say ;)

sciencesaves on October 27, 2008, 9:50 AM

resonator, Religion provides no answers.

As long as an individual assigns meaning to them, they will suffer from the subliminal doubts and frustration that almost always occurs.

You don’t need to be committed if you learn more about the history of religion as opposed to adopting the blind faith/belief outlook that results from fear and misunderstang.

Obviously, you’re past the comfort zone mentality that so many believers embrace.

Good for you.

Matt Pidlysny on October 27, 2008, 10:36 AM

blind faith/belief outlook that results from fear and misunderstang.

I’ll have you know that I renounced Religion a long time ago. While Gnosticism is kind of a religion it’s more of a classification of a kind of thinker, honestly. I would say with sincere honesty from MY viewpoint that being a Christian is like entry level God worshipping, so to speak. There IS the father, there IS the son, and there IS the holy spirit (Also, Mary and the Apostles). The problem is that it simply had to be this way. If the truth about Gnosticism was main spread, this design wouldn’t have come to be and we wouldn’t exist.

In any case, be that as it may, I think you should head back over to the Oliver Sacks discussion to find out a bit more on what is really false and why. But before you do, you gotta know that belief in truth can satisfy any hunger, and when the hunger is satisfied alot of things are possible. Be it known that while I can’t seem to satisfy the hunger I need yet to channel truth the way I want, they can.

Matt Pidlysny on October 27, 2008, 10:36 AM

Also, just to say this, I think you can say the same quote in regards to yourself, my friend :)

pokój! on October 28, 2008, 3:09 AM

resonator I responded in your old topic ’can the power of thought…"

sciencesaves on October 28, 2008, 9:01 AM

resonator, I could say the same thing about myself? I’m not sure which quote you’re referring to.

You claim gnosticism is a higher level of thinking, but as long as you continue to assert “fact” without evidence, it seems to be just another form of delusion, perhaps a step up from the primitive thinking, but it’s only watered-down nonsense, as opposed to fully concentrated religious concepts.

Reality is not as bad or scary as you might think, and you’re on the right track to eventually see the light.

Look beyond emotional needs, that’s where the real truth resides.