A rare occasion of faith, reason and compatibility with science:
Our father, who art in heaven;
our mother, the earth:
we are your children...
In this twenty first century scientifically understood world we need a god that MEASURES OUR UNDERSTANDING rather than insulting our knowledge.
And in the 21'st century we don't need mumbo-jumbo; we need a faith that will spur us to escape these 'Progress Traps' (Ronald Wright) that we have created for ourselves: Energy Scarcity and Climate Change.
Neither Middle Age, Bronze Age nor New Age beliefs fit within these parameters.
First, be clear that my spiritual arguments are based upon our understanding of how the universe works. Of course our scientific knowledge is limited, but it is the only calculator we have with which to measure god.
This is our first great understanding: that all life's energy comes from the Sun. We are completely surrounded by the life-energy of the sun. The immense overwhelming mass of this blast furnace gives rise to life and sustains it. As this energy is necessary for life; can energy be life, or the wellspring of life? Cannot the Sun be seen as the father of this creation?
The Sun is our father in heaven and the earth is our mother. Life exists because of this relationship. The giver of life on this planet is the Sun, with the kind of life that exists here governed by this relationship.
The Sun is our father in heaven.
http://www.bigthink.com/faith-beliefs/9020
Discuss
Mary Coyote on March 24, 2008, 2:30 AM
I don’t think it is good enough to merely rate this idea ‘less interesting’ unless you follow the link and ponder how a religion could be drawn from our understanding of the world, rather than our understanding-of-the-world be drawn from our religion.
I am offering an alternative that is very relevant to this discussion as it offers a ‘third way.’
Please chew on it.
Musycks on March 25, 2008, 9:56 PM
Hey Coyote,
Is the idea of a Father sun and Mother earth, while beautiful and poetic, another variant on the ‘heavenly father’ stuff? My thought is that the sun, like the universe is of itself, indifferent to our existance.. even though it is the thing that nurtures and sustains life here?
and it’s not good enough to merely rate an idea and not expand on it.. to those who did… get in the game or stay out altogether.
Mary Coyote on March 26, 2008, 2:33 AM
Very good! I purposely use ‘Our Heavenly Father’ because it resonates with the Christian heritage of our culture: most folks easily recognize this terminology. But as I have posted elsewhere, sex is unimportant.
How can you so easily assume an uncaring indifferent Sun, when self-conscious sentient life bubbles froths and boils BECAUSE of a very special relationship between this star and the Earth. A mere coincidence? A natural consequence of existence as suggested by Quantum Science?
The former is impossible, while the second implies a Logos. The local Logos is the Sun/earth relationship. The Sun screams out a song in many wavelengths and our mother earth has a history of spurting life because of her relationship to this Logos or song.
To argue that it is inconsequential that some of that life appears to be sentient, is to argue for impossible odds.
Musycks on March 27, 2008, 8:52 PM
Again a beautiful idea with the notion of a special relationship between the sun and earth.. but it opens up a lot of questions. Why Earth and not Mars to set the conditions for sentient beings? Does that ascribe the idea of choice in the relationship? Did Earth choose yes, please ‘impregnate’ me, and Mars play hard to get?!
.. but as it’s unknowable I feel, I would be agnostic towards this idea, currently.
I remember being moved by Arthur C Clarkes description of the dying Earth in ‘Childhoods End’, so these type of concepts hold a certain allure…
Mary Coyote on March 28, 2008, 12:25 AM
Musycks posted; ‘Did Earth choose yes, please ’impregnate’ me, and Mars play hard to get?!‘
I don’t know. Why don’t you read some Greek myths: you may find your answer there.
It may be that the precise mathematical relationship of the earth to the sun is necessary for this Logos or song, or it may be that we may yet find the universe teaming with life. Give it the right amount of the right energy matter time space and it blossoms. We don’t know that there is no life on mars or one of Jupiter’s moons, but we are looking.
Musycks on March 30, 2008, 9:45 PM
Dear Coyote… Greek myths? the name I use should be a giveaway there..
not sure that any of the ancient myths indicate much except a yearning for ‘other’.. trying to contextualise our human experience by the available tools of the day like stories and myths, the contents of which are not at all outside the range of the human mind?
Let’s agree that from what we know life in any form in the Universe is a rare event… let’s celebrate it’s specialness and not demean it by the ‘I am not worthy’ type nonsense the mainstream pushes.
We are drawn by the sirens of Titan… as are we all.
ps. If people think an atheist can’t write beautiful mystical trancendant prose.. try Kurt Vonnegut.
Mary Coyote on March 31, 2008, 9:34 PM
musycks posted: ’Let’s agree that from what we know life in any form in the Universe is a rare event… let’s celebrate it’s specialness’
I don’t think that we can agree to that. We just don’t know; we assume our specialness by FAITH.
And I don’t agree with you about mythology. The stories are part of the human journey; they are the history of the human song; and they may better reflect who we are than the modern myths we currently tell ourselves.
Musycks on March 31, 2008, 10:29 PM
maybe myths modern or old stem from the same place… the need to see and understand our environment.. and therefore have a better chance of surviving in it?
is one coping mechanism superior to another?.. yes.
as for the specialness of life?.. given we don’t know much, and are barely into the stars, we can at least say as of now, that life AS WE KNOW IT, is a kind of.. miracle! haha… couldn’t resist.
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