In response to 'finding your self in hell' by thatguy
http://www.bigthink.com/faith-beliefs/9260
Most near-death experiences report heaven like conditions: love, light, deceased loved ones... while a minority are hell-experiences. Most of these report, not a lake of fire, but a rejection, or a 'casting out' into the pit, or the void of space. An utter absence of god (light, love, loved ones) by impossible distance. The sense of being commanded into the void prevails.
I am familiar with the experience as I had it as a child that almost died several times. Most who hear this story ask: why would god condemn an innocent child? I see it differently. Innocence is NOT a harvestable commodity; life experience is. In the garden of life, fruits and vegetables are harvestable, while those that bear no fruit or rotten fruit are cast into the compost bin. Recycled.
Hell is the recycler of soul stuff.
...
Again, the film Constantine portrays both an excellent image of Coyote (Gabriel) as having her own agenda, AND a relevant image of Hell.
I saw the film as depicting Hell as a POSSIBLE FUTURE with the blast furnace of the sun raking over the planet and our constructed world. Or a possible nuclear holocaust future where the very atmosphere and surface of the planet catch fire. E.g: the planets surface is loaded with hydrogen.
Another example: scientists are concerned that the earth's magnetic field seems to be sputtering; failure of this field will expose us to the full fury of the sun as depicted in the film.
There is evidence that our magnetic field has failed and reversed in the past. The passing of our solar system through the center of our galaxy's central plane in 2012 (end of the Mayan Long Count Calender; e.g: end-of-the-world) may affect this, akin to moving from a positive into a negative field.
Remember that the 'missing dark matter' has just been located and seems to be arranged in a grid, or web-like pattern or framework of the universe. As mathematical or GEOMETRIC TRUTHS are the ONLY objective truths that we can discern, it makes sense that the universe's structure itself is a geometric field. Therefore, moving through the central plane of our galaxy should also mean moving through the geometrical field which makes our galaxy a spinning disk of energy and mass.
...
I see Hell and Armageddon as CULTURAL WARNING POSTS; a part of the Human Song that warns us to beware that our choices can easily destroy us. I also like the recent depictions in media (such as the TV series Heroes) where evolution or the Human Song will raise up heroes or prophets to warn us of and perhaps save us from such futures.
And to make jesseakers happy, the Bible does indeed tell us that is what will happen in the 'end times:' the rise of dreams, visions and prophets. Of course the problem is that the Bible also tells us that it is hopeless to struggle, that we are all going to die and that the world will most certainly be totally destroyed.
We already know that a 'new earth' will replace the destruction of this biosphere, as it has happened repeatedly in the past. Ten million years after an earth destroying event, it is like nothing has happened, except that everything is different. Are Christians going to sit in a spaceship waiting in suspended animation for several million years for the planet to rebuild, or are we going to pay attention to the warning signs within the Human Song and postpone the inevitable?
HELL IS THE INEVITABLE.
See also:
The Sun is our father in heaven.
http://www.bigthink.com/faith-beliefs/9020
12 page discussion of objective truths:
http://www.bigthink.com/faith-beliefs/10136
Discuss
sciencesaves on May 24, 2008, 5:04 PM
Visions and illusions as the brain ceases to function, and the lights go out?
Musycks on May 24, 2008, 6:26 PM
Coyote, welcome back.. it’s roundabout way of saying look after our home, so I second that emotion. The mythic overlay a little spicy for my taste. Someone recently observed that man behaved more like a virus than anything else, and at the rate we’re consuming the planets resources at the expense of all else, we will definately end up killing the host.
I’ve already got my red outfit picked out though!
Mary Coyote on May 24, 2008, 7:05 PM
musycks: Hi, like your avatar.
In my garden I let Mother Nature have her way. I noticed that if I plant an invasive species that it will spread until I hack it back or it hits some other resistance. WHEN it does meet resistance, the species tends to stay restricted in size, where BEFORE its spread seemed unchecked and weedy.
So where our activity can be seen as virus-like, remember that the most virulent viruses are the ones that evolution slaughters. If the virus kills it host quickly, it also dies before it can spread. We saw this when the syphilis virus was introduced into Europe. At first it killed rapidly, but that led to an evolutionary dead end before it could be spread to a new host. The current strain kills very very slowly.
Thus as an INTELLIGENT SPECIES, the purpose of environmentalism in a future world of Climate Change, Energy Scarcity, hunger and warfare, is to act as Mother Nature’s pruning sheers……………………………….shudder.
See that question here:
http://www.bigthink.com/features/456
Mary Coyote on May 24, 2008, 7:12 PM
sciencesaves: did you scroll down and read the entire post? I addressed Hell as a NDE; as a devastating possible future; as a scientific possibility; and as a cultural icon. What you posted was said before by thousands of folks. Entertain me with an argument rather than a dismissal.
sciencesaves on May 24, 2008, 11:15 PM
Apologies, I sure didn’t, but wasn’t dismissing, just tired. (note the question mark.)
I do believe the new form of “religion” will be some type of tree-hugger mentality, coupled with the necessary spiritual element for those who need that aspect.
I have mentioned environmental issues in other posts. This is a huge challenge in the 21st century. I fear that short-sighted self interest and politics will create an environment we will find increasingly uninhabitable. The statistics on climate change are alarming. Our planet is so delicately balanced to support life, that seemingly minor changes in average temperatures can be catastrophic. We are witnessing the mass extinction of species that had survived and evolved through natural disasters, but not man-made ones. I’ve heard of the magnetic reversal theory. If that turns out to be the case, we’re screwed. One things for sure, we live in interesting times!
The earth will shrug us off like we never even existed, as you say.
I’m not here to argue with you, I believe there is the possibility that man will create a “hell” on earth, but it really has nothing whatsoever to do with a perceived creator, or omni-god. People will continue to believe in whatever makes the warm fuzzies while reality grinds away.
I’ve read some of your stuff, and you seem to be quite intelligent. I hate labels, and I pretty much line up with musycks across the board, so I am basically atheistic, but I lean toward humanism as a philosophy.
Good to have some feminine input for a change!
pokój! on May 25, 2008, 1:33 AM
Coyote please don’t make the mistake of writing off Christians as most others have done, there are many who are still living in the here and now… we are a part of your human song as well, and are not as stagnant as many believe…
Mary Coyote on May 27, 2008, 4:05 AM
sciencesaves: Thanks for your response. I don’t need arguments, but I really appreciate a couple paragraphs of your thoughts. Thanks.
I really like your idea of a ‘new form of “religion” will be some type of tree-hugger mentality,’ and am thinking about that. Hopefully I will have something to post soon.
pokoj: I criticize Christianity because that is the religion I am most familiar with. Indeed Christianity is a valid part of the Human Song as you may notice that I often call to it’s arguments. I only demand that Christians expand their POV to better fit our understanding of the world rather than seeking security in obsolete worldviews. I’ll try to find some time to read some of your 25 IDEAS and post comments.
I opened your profile and I see that your avatar is NOT Camels cigarettes, as I assumed, but Canned Platypus!!! ha ha ha
Shawn Wilson on October 17, 2008, 6:40 PM
I didn’t even read anyones comments sorry …but just saying this we as humans have energy within our selves everyting does…I think everyone will agree with this…so…therefore energy can neither be created nor destroyed…simple..all energy just keeps changing form and going through its cycles just like everything else in the universe..
Tyler Reimann on November 4, 2008, 4:59 PM
I support your thoughts on this Coyote. I also absolutely agree with Karmanical. Life is a cycle. the universe is a cycle. Existence is a cycle.
Tyler Reimann on November 4, 2008, 5:01 PM
I may not have had any neardeath experiences, but i believe in random reincarnation very firmly.
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